# Increasing Cocktail Class Racer Max Payload
**URL:** https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755
**Category:** Builder's Forum
**Created:** [June 12, 2012, 6:17pm UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755 "2012-06-12T18:17:06Z")
**Posts on this page:** 8
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Rick\_Swink](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/Rick_Swink)
#### Post date: [June 12, 2012, 6:17pm UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/1 "2012-06-12T18:17:06Z")
I'm wondering if this is possible. I saw the boat on a Modern Marvels rerun and I had been thinking about building a little sailboat for a while but this thing looks a lot more fun. I probably won't be doing any racing...just playing.
My questions is if it is possible to increase the max payload (I'm assuming this does not include the weight of the outboard?) of these things at all. Maybe adding foam in the cavities?
The reason I ask is because I'm a larger guy (310lbs). I'm planning to lose weight but we all know that that ends up going most of the time. I'd like to build one that will support me. With the heavy weight comes a boat that would ride a little lower in the water. How would they hold up with a bigger outboard (15-20hp)? Since I most likely won't be racing it, I'm not too concerned about meeting the regulations...just keeping the thing on the top of the water.
Any tips/suggestions would be appreciated. I might have to look into stopping by the shop to get tips from the folks at CLC as well.
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### Author:  [@Lee\_Edmonds](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/Lee_Edmonds)
#### Post date: [June 13, 2012, 9:23am UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/2 "2012-06-13T09:23:40Z")
The only way to increase max payload is to build a larger boat. Adding foam just adds more weight, though it might add some crushability up front when you hit something at 100 mph with a 20-hp outboard.
Kidding aside, you don't add a fire-breathing V-8 to a go cart to handle a larger driver. Putting a 15- to 20-hp outboard on a Cocktail Class boat breaks all kinds of common-sense rules as well as Coast Guard recommendations.
Stop by CLC, talk to them and look at their CCRs. You're a good candidate for an 8-hp powered boat. Good luck if you build one.
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### Author:  [@David\_Ludwig](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/David_Ludwig)
#### Post date: [June 13, 2012, 11:28am UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/3 "2012-06-13T11:28:57Z")
was there yesterday. There's one in the showroom.
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### Author:  [@Rick\_Swink](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/Rick_Swink)
#### Post date: [June 13, 2012, 12:51pm UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/4 "2012-06-13T12:51:51Z")
You're right, you don't add a fire-breathing V-8 to a go cart to handle a larger driver. You do it just to be awesome and go fast and possibly die.
I was just worried that the boat would seem a bit sluggish with only 8hp and a 300+lb driver. I guess 20hp would probably damage some stuff though...
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### Author:  [@Lee\_Edmonds](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/Lee_Edmonds)
#### Post date: [June 13, 2012, 1:46pm UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/5 "2012-06-13T13:46:47Z")
A 6-hp powered CCR would be sluggish to get up on plane with your weight and its top speed would suffer some, especially if the outboard wasn't running correctly. An 8-hp CCR would get you on plane right now, but you still wouldn't go as fast as a CCR driven by a 200-lb driver, running a mph or three slower. You could still have a lot of fun driving. Again, I suggest you visit CLC to check out a CCR in person. You also might go to a Cocktail Class event, or contact someone that has an 8-hp powered CCR, and ask what they think. We race an 8-hp powered CCR with a driver a little lighter than you and are competitive.
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### Author:  [@Russ\_Gale](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/Russ_Gale)
#### Post date: [March 17, 2014, 7:16am UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/6 "2014-03-17T07:16:00Z")
Gee, I'm looking at that boat and it is nifty but at 8 ft and 70 lbs I can't see it being safe if things get a bit bumpy. OK, I know you're cloning an original design, but has anyone scaled it up to around 12 ft with a 9.5 or 10 hp max? That would probably allow two kids to ride in it for some fun use besides just racing and provide a bit more safety margin as even a pond can get choppy and why limit use to glass-smooth conditions? I see the drivers leaning off the bow of the boat and I can't say I'd be crazy about my kid operating a boat in that fashion.
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### Author:  [@John\_C\_Harris](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/John_C_Harris)
#### Post date: [March 17, 2014, 10:24am UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/7 "2014-03-17T10:24:55Z")
\>\>\>\>How would they hold up with a bigger outboard (15-20hp)?
Structurally the Cocktail Class couldn't handle that much power; the transom would break.
The weight of an outboard that size would submerge the stern, even at rest and with a light crew aboard, causing the boat to down-flood over the transom.
And the 8-foot hull can't handle the speeds that 2x or 3x the rated horsepower would yield. There would be loss of control followed by death or serious injury. For perspective, the 15-foot [Peeler Skiff](http://www.clcboats.com/shop/boats/powerboats/peeler-outboard-power-skiff.html) has a max horsepower of 15.
\>\>\>My questions is if it is possible to increase the max payload
\>\>\> I know you're cloning an original design, but has anyone scaled it up to around 12 ft\>\>\>
It's not possible to scale up the Cocktail Class Racer---it would require a new design, not simple scaling factors in CAD.
Think of it like this: You really, really like the Nissan 300Z, but it's not a comfortable fit. You don't call up Nissan and say, "Hey, great car, but can you run me out one with a longer wheelbase and more power?" Instead, you shop around for a car that's a better fit for you. Likewise, there ARE bigger speedboats out there!
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### Author:  [@Curt\_Dennis](https://forum.clcboats.com/u/Curt_Dennis)
#### Post date: [March 17, 2014, 10:56am UTC](https://forum.clcboats.com/t/increasing-cocktail-class-racer-max-payload/39755/8 "2014-03-17T10:56:33Z")
Just to add some info, I built a J Class Runabout (9' long) hard chine when I was 15 (mid sixties) using fiberglassed canvas instead of wood and beat the crap out of it even in the straits of Mackinac. Had an 18 HP Johnson and it topped out around 30 MPH or a little more. Google "J Class Runabout" and there is even one manufacturer still selling the plans or frame kit. This boat (however) still does not have the payload you are looking for, so this is just for reference. Another thing you should factor in is the importance of matching a propeller to the boat, payload, desire for hole shots or top end. I had a plastic racing prop designed for top end, and I had to lean out way over the bow to get it on plane. You also have the issue of to skeg or not to skeg. No skeg is a blast to go sideways, but with a skeg really bites into the corners.
You might Google words like J Class, Monoplane, Hydroplane, etc...doing that I found this...
[http://www.glen-l.com/designs/outboard/classcd.html](http://www.glen-l.com/designs/outboard/classcd.html)
Curt 830/997-8120