Hi all, I’m a new boat builder/sailor. I live in socal and looking for recommendations on which boat would be good for 2 people to fish and sail around the coastal waters. I’ve been looking for a long time and unable to come to a good conclusion. There aren’t a lot of big bay areas here. Right now I’m leaning toward a mill creek 16.5 with outrigger sailing rig or a passagemaker standard. Thanks for any suggestions and ideas.
I have a Passagemaker Take-Apart. I think it could work well as a row boat/ fishing boat for two. It’s a bit tight for two adults sailing. The center seat divides up the space and the front area is small. It can work, but you need to be agile. I have both the Gunter sloop and lug rigs for it and, in general, would recommend the lug as it is very easy to set up and take down so you can convert quickly from sailing to rowing outings.
I’ll let others chime in on other boats,
Cool, thanks Steve. I thought it might be a bit tight with 2 adults so I was considering the NE dory as well but my garage space would be wiped out with a boat that long.
I’ve sat in the front and I’m 6’1” and 190. Changing sides after a tack is a bit troublesome. If you plan on doing a lot of 2 adult sailing then I’d opt for something bigger or less compartmentalized.
It is a nice boat though!
-Steve
Where in Southern California are you planning to fish and sail? How far offshore? Are you departing from a harbor or launching through the surf? Do you have small boat experience in the socal coastal conditions? Remember, that water is usually pretty cold, depending on where you are the waves can have a fetch of thousands of miles and there are kelp beds, currents and lots of traffic.
I’m not saying that small boats like the ones CLC sells can’t be fun and safe out there. I remember reading posts by builders here who have sailed/paddled to Catalina. But I am concerned by you describing yourself as a “new boat builder/sailor”.
I did my first sailing in a homebuilt boat in San Diego over 50 years ago, so I’m definitely not trying to discourage you. I’m just wondering if you should consider a first boat that is meant only for the bays until you get a bunch of experience under your belt. I had a lot of fun in Mission Bay with an 8-ft boat back in the 70’s.
But getting back to your original questions, a Lighthouse Tender Peapod is very stable, has a large cockpit, sails well and is a joy to row. I’ve sailed and rowed mine with 2 comfortably. For fishing with 2, I’d recommend rowing it just because the sailrig would be an obstacle to casting. I haven’t had mine offshore, but have taken 2-3 ft wakes with no water coming aboard, much to the surprise of my passenger who expected to get soaking wet.
It’s a boat you can get more adventurous with as you gain experience. With a very careful eye on the weather, you’ll even be able to take it out into the ocean once you learn what the sea is doing and how to get along with it.
Laszlo
I am planning to utilize the OC beaches either beach launch or boat ramp depending what I end up going with. I’ve considered the Lighthouse as well but I had thought it looked a bit complex for a first time builder.
My goal is to fish for yellow tail in the area between the OC beaches and Catalina. I would also like to do coastal cruising up to Santa Barbara and the like. Seems like 5 to 10 nm off shore outta do.
The Skerry seems like a good option I am also considering. I am a bit space limited so I like that its shorter than a Dory but bigger than the Passagemaker.
Thanks again for the tips.
William,
Someone just posted a completed Skerry for sale in OC - 15' Skerry For Sale
At the very least, you may be able to try out the boat and see if it suits your needs. Best case, you could get started on the sailing/fishing part right away.
Laszlo
William, I was just watching this thread from the sidelines, but I’m beginning to worry a bit for you maybe not getting a real word of caution in the responses so far. I know Shakelton and Captain Bligh made some heroic ocean voyages in open boats - I’ve read their stories - but I’m sure there are a whole lot of stories we’ve never heard, because no one lived to tell them.
I was stationed (on submarines) out of Point Loma for a couple of years, while living aboard a 41 ft. world-cruise capable ketch. Apart from traveling the world submerged over a Naval career, and spending time on USN surface ships in the Carribean, Atlantic, Med and Arabian Gulf, I sailed my ketch out from San Diego out to the channel Islands/Catalina a few times, and brought the boat around to Florida via the Panama Canal. I also have sailed a number of other boats from 11 ft to 75 ft in various lakes, great lakes and oceans around the world. I’ve sailed a sailboard from Stonington, CT out to Block Island (accompanied by a powerboat). Also been in the North Atlantic in December on an aircraft carrier when it blew 80 kts for 3 days straight - resulting in some 35 ft. seas (yes, really). Anyway, I’m trying to say I’ve been in all sorts of boats and seen the ocean in all her moods (both calm and furious), including the area you are talking about.
I’ve sailed and rowed my NE Dory (on lakes) for 7 years now. About the worst I’ve seen in her is 20 kt gust with 2.5 ft waves (sailing reefed) - in a lake with a well-populated shoreline never more than a half-mile away. She has shipped some water, but I’ve never capsized. I’ve added extra floatation, and even with that I’ve done a dockside capsize test, carrying a hand pump and a bailer for recovery. In that test it was evident that I could recover the boat in calm water, but in anything more than a small breeze with small (less than 6 inch) waves I would never have been able to dewater the boat. No mater what the weather report said, you’d never find me 5 nm out in the Catlina / San Pedro Channel in a small boat open boat that didn’t come up dry or recoverable if capsized, especially out there in a cold current. Athough I wouldn’t recommend it or do it myself, I’d rather be out there in a Laser or my Chess 17 kayak than my NE Dory. Anyway, please think things over - and until you’ve done a capsize recover test in a sheltered, near shore/near dock area, I don’t think you have the information you need to “properly” think things over if you are considering an small open boat for ocean-going use. Consider what a freighter wake (or large pleasure boat wake) might do to you even on an abolutelty calm day.
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Just to bandwagon on what Jeff was saying a bit. I’m retired Coast Guard, I’ve been out on the ocean in some fairly small craft as well. I was on a 210 foot cutter in a storm off Hatteras and thought today could be the end. If you have serious space limitations for building but still need a blue water boat. It’s not a CLC design, but you might consider the SCAMP. https://www.scampsailboat.com/ She is designed to survive more hell than I care to be out in. John Welsford knows a thing or two about serious water.
I watched the Scamp capsize video on the website. If going “offshore” (and here I’m referring to near shore, too, not necessarily out of sight of land) in the ocean, something like the Scamp looks to be a possibility. Note that there is also the CLC Skerry Raid to consider. The key points are that the boat is partially decked to shed some water, able to ship some water in rougher seas, and what it does goes ship can go back overboard without operator involvement, has some water ballasting, can be righted by the crew (one person if you plan to go solo) and comes up mostly dry after righting - ready to sail/row/motor on. It appears that the Scamp is unlikely to turtle, that is nice. I also saw Scamps operating with small motors, something you might want to consider. Watching carefully, I think that I saw the skipper use a pre-installed boarding line (loop for a foot) that helped to give a “leg up” for re-entry. Although a higher hurdle to get over than the midships gunwale, it looks like there is room for a small pre-installed foldable boarding ladder on the transom. I have one of those on my Flying Scot. Only had to use it (as a necessity) once, other than that, only when I purposefully decide to take a swim between races.
So William, I now I think this thread should have you on the right track towards what to think about when thinking about a boat for your intended usage. Most home-builts that fit your need will be slightly more complicated construction than something like a regular Skerry, but really all that means is the boat will take more time and money to build, not that a boat with more parts is that much harder to build than one with fewer. Good luck!
I appreciate these thoughtful insights from you all. My dreams and ambitions do seem to be a bit excessive for the resources currently available to me. I might stick with a kayak and hangout near the shore for the time being. I will probably take the coast guard sailing course as well to get a better idea of what I am getting into. I am in the aviation industry myself so I know good advice from experienced pros when I hear it. Slow is smooth and smooth is fast.
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Go big get my Madness Pacific Proa its Catalina Island capable trailers ok and is very fast and stable. I listed it here
2016 Chesapeake Light Craft Madness 31-Foot Pacific Proa sailboat for sale in California
It will take you across the Catalina channel in a few hours on a broad reach!!!
Absolutely horrible idea for a " new boat builder/sailor". The build is rated at the top of the difficulty and is 1600 hours. It needs a workspace that can accommodate a 30+ ft main hull.
The basic ready-to-sail hull weight is 1,400 lbs, so this will max out or exceed a lot of tow vehicles. Even if a truck can pull it, at that weight California requires trailer brakes and a breakaway system so the trailer will be a significant cost.
When being trailered it has to be broken down into crossbeams, outrigger, main hull, trampoline, sailing rig, etc. Not only does it take significant time to assemble and disassemble, there’s a 500 lb main hull to get on and off the trailer.
It’s only in the middle of the stability range so it will need skillful sailing. It also scoots along at speeds in the high teens so it needs a sailor who is experienced enough to react withing the safety windows of those speeds.
It’s a really great boat that delivers speed and comfort, but the costs (and not just the money) are not something that a new builder and new sailor can reasonably be expected to handle.
Laszlo
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