Outrigger Junior

Hello everybody, 

I wonder if there is anybody here with some insiders information concerning the Junior Outrigger and when it will be finally available. I discovered the pictures of the boat almost 2 years ago, I immediately fell in love with her, (this is THE boat I always dreamed of), and since that time, I am taking infinite pain every morning coming to the site and nervously checking if it has been relased or not. This is a big stress every morning...

May be for Christmas ?

Quousque tandem abutere...

 

 

 

 I have a dream... The plans for the Junior Outrigger are finally ready and available, AND I have plenty of time to built it...

In the meantime, I try to think...

I am a bit afraid by the big sail. as I am not a great sailor...  Would it make sense if we added a second ama, in order to  make it a trimaran ? May be it is stupid because there is no need for it, or it would be to heavy ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

This is what I love about this forum. Where else do you find boat builders quoting Cicero in the original Latin, appropriate to the post?

Thank you

Laszlo

 

  Check out the big brain on Laszlo... SEEYA Jack 

The Outrigger Junior is an exciting project in which we've invested massively.  It's coming.

For years the feedback from all corners (including this bulletin board) is emphatic, and correct:  If the instruction manual isn't as near to perfect as possible without inciting the jealousy of the gods, don't ship the kit.  

The Outrigger Junior is straightforward for amateurs to build. Writing and illustrating its instruction manual is not.  We're taking our time.  While I'm miserably aware of the long lag between the first sail and the completion of the manual, I'd prefer to lose the faith of some early enthusiasts than short-change such a good design with an underbaked manual. 

Cuivis dolori remedium est patientia.

CLC Outrigger Junior

John,

Let me put in my vote for a two-tier manual system. If we present proof of having already built at least 1 boat and are willing to sign a no-bitching waiver that's at least as strong as the go-ahead-and-let-me-drown-myself waiver for Okoumefest, could we get a 2nd best manual (+kit) today instead of a perfect one tomorrow?

Lingua mortua sola lingua bona est

Laszlo

 

 Many thanks, John, for your detailled answer.

It is fear to say that passion, patience and patior (suffer) have the same origin...

I fully understand your quest for excellence, and that excellence does not accept any compromise. 

I run a small business with high end quality products, and I very much understand your approach.

But, I am a woodworker per profession, I have alreay worked with epoxy and composite, and I know by heart almost all the wonderfull videos you have made available, concerning the buidling of a boat, canoe, etc... Together with the few pictures of the building of the Outrigger, I really think that I would be able to construct the boat. As Laszlo,  I even can sign all necessary weavers as a Beta User... 

As a matter of fact, it will take me 6 months or one year to build the boat. This would let you plenty of the time to complete the manual, and send it to me before I finish. At least, I would be able to begin.

Wouldn't it make sense ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Looking over the picures of the OJ I had a few questions/thoughts.  I started my sailing life on Hobies so I am coming at it from that direction. 

One of the things I think they got right are thier kick-up rudders.  Has there been any thought about adding a Hobie rudder to the OJ?  I am thinking the rudder from an H18 would be a good fit.

For land transportation you can, obviously, disassemble and trailer the OJ.  Would it be able to handle remaining assembled and being tilted on a trailer?  The tilting is to reduce the width so you can leagaly tow it.  Leaving it assembled would drastically reduce launch time.

Finally, on catamarans the trampoline is an important part of the structure of the boat.  Getting it properly taught has a significant effect on boat performance.  It helps keep the boat rigid so there is minimal wasted energy in the different parts "moving" around.  Does the trampoline on the OJ serve this function in addition to being a good area for the crew or is the connection of the hulls to the crossbeams rigid enough?

It's a really cool looking boat and from what I see in the videos it sails really well.  I look forward to getting a chance to sail it at Okumefest in May.

 

Nick

   

I thought life was challenging enough just trying to build my Northeaster Dory. Now I have to resurrect my high school Latin just to understand what is being said on this bulletin board!

Ex nihilo nihil fit.

   I don't speak Latin. mo’Dajvo’ pa’wIjDaq je narghpu’ He’So’bogh SajlIj.

George K

George,

Thanks for finding my cat.

Laszlo

 

   There are Klingons on the starboard bow...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FCARADb9asE

Merry Christmas!

Dan

Graecum est; non legitur

>>>Together with the few pictures of the building of the Outrigger, I really think that I would be able to construct the boat. As Laszlo,  I even can sign all necessary waivers as a Beta User... >>>>

 

Well, fair enough, we know the kit works, have ironed out 100% of the details, and even have a beautiful set of plans complete.  Send me an email (john@clcboats.com) if you want to talk about getting a BETA version.  We've already had six of them built so we have gleaned as much insight as we ever will from BETA builders.  I get fried almost daily (sometimes deservedly, often not) by people with questions arising from instruction manuals.  Thus the pace of new-manual-rollout has been slowed while we wring our hands and edit and edit and edit and edit and edit.  Wish I could go make it go faster.  We just did a bunch of hiring and that will help in the medium-term.

>>>Has there been any thought about adding a Hobie rudder to the OJ?  I am thinking the rudder from an H18 would be a good fit.
<>>>>>>

I'm not a huge Hobie Cat rudder fan, but part of the fun of building the boat yourself is that you can experiment with that sort of thing!  I think a Hobie 18 rudder would be a little too small for the OJ.  (It has only one rudder, after all.)

>>>>For land transportation you can, obviously, disassemble and trailer the OJ.  Would it be able to handle remaining assembled and being tilted on a trailer?  The tilting is to reduce the width so you can leagaly tow it.  Leaving it assembled would drastically reduce launch time.
>>>>>>>

I've thought of that, and the idea is appealing.  But recall the OJ is twelve feet wide overall (part of the secret sauce that makes it so fast).  Tilted to fit within the 8'6" trailering limit, it would be 11 feet high on the trailer (if you include the height of the trailer itself)!

This year we fitted the boat with ratchet straps for the beam connectives.  Extensive tests showed this to be as strong as the 1/8th-inch nylon lashings, and it takes a fraction of the time.  The OJ now takes about as long to rig from a standing-start as a Hobie Cat.  The Hobie's hull and tramp stay assembled on the trailer of course, but its mast and rigging take ten times longer than the OJ's lateen rig, so they come out about the same.

 

>>
>Finally, on catamarans the trampoline is an important part of the structure of the boat.  Getting it properly taught has a significant effect on boat performance.  It helps keep the boat rigid so there is minimal wasted energy in the different parts "moving" around.  Does the trampoline on the OJ serve this function in addition to being a good area for the crew or is the connection of the hulls to the crossbeams rigid enough?
>>>

We sailed the boats briefly without trampolines.  This was workable, and the assembly was more than stiff enough, but it was not especially comfortable for the crew.

At first the tramps were laced on, which took a lifetime to do.  Now we've fitted tracks to the hulls so that the tramps are slid into place, then tensioned with a quick spiral lacing.  It takes minutes.  I'm sure the OJ is stiffer with a tramp than without, but it certainly didn't feel flimsy without.

Here we are back in 2014, using the lashing method.  If you could keep the boat rigged all summer, this would be ideal.  

Outrigger Sailboat Kit

Outrigger Sailboat Kit

Outrigger Sailboat Kit

Outrigger Sailboat Kit

Outrigger Sailboat kit

Outrigger Sailboat Kit

I'm one of the BETA builders John referred to.  For a brief period last year, CLC offered two partially built prototype OJs for sale on the website. I ventured over to Annapolis to take a look and bought one on the spot. What I got was two assembled but unfinished hulls, assembled outriggers, mast, centerboard and rudder, a pile of wood pieces and a set of drawings.  I also got a manual--not the manual I hasten to add. It was a manual for a Shearwater kayak to explain basic building techniques, and John assured me the OJ manual would be available before I finished (dig, dig). I hauled all this to Richmond and set up shop in a rented unheated garage in November last year.

I'm a first time builder but have accumulated a fair amount of woodworking knowledge over the years. No experience with fiberglass and epoxy though.  I read a lot of posts on this forum and learned a lot, especially from Lazlo. I viewed Moonchaser's slideshow of his dory build at least a dozen times and never ceased admiring his technique and creativity. And of course I got a lot of help from John. I hope that my feedback to him was of enough use to compensate for the pestering.

I finshed up this October and got in a few sailing days on Swift Creek Reservoir near Richmond VA.  I have a lot of sailing experience, but not recently in a daysailer and never in a multihull. This boat is very responsive. You can lift the ama easily in 6 knots of wind, and in puffy shifty winds on a lake you really have to pay attention. The acceleration in a puff is thrilling. It requires not a little agility to sail--if, for example, you linger too long on the starboard side when tacking to port tack you will be swimming.

I'm very happy how it turned out.  I thank Lazlo for the tip on using carbon infused epoxy on the bottom. I plan to be at Okumefest in the Spring.

   Many thanks, John, for your proposal. I will contact you directly.

David, this is such a beautifull boat! Georgous! This will make me hesitate if I keep the wood varnished or if I put a nice white paint on it...

Anyway, in order to occupy my waiting, I had made a small model...

 

[img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-LPDWsrLup20/VnZnGk7YDQI/AAAAAAAALII/74QaAs95kww/s320/2.JPG[/img]

 

[img]http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-29ixzvj3ffM/VnZnGcaoW0I/AAAAAAAALIE/VHJP6uvi6w8/s320/3.JPG[/img]

 

[img]http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-Uh6W2i2xF54/VnZnHF7dM9I/AAAAAAAALIU/x-CF1sNs8x0/s320/4.JPG[/img]

 

[img]http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-Q-HN4Vutn6s/VnZnHhzr0yI/AAAAAAAALIc/JswEd09WzUw/s320/5.JPG[/img]

 

 

 

   

David,

Beautiful job of finishing the build. Makes me real glad that I'm not bringing anything to Okoumefest for judging in the Small Craft category. I'd have to surrender right now. That black and white scheme is very striking.

Looks like you're using cam cleats instead of lashings or ratchet straps. How are those working out?

And, in the spirit of linguistics demonstrated earlier in this thread, I got that Kinamwe is in the Chuukese language from Micronesia and that it means peaceful, but what's Lien? A proper name? Is your boat named after someone?

Looking forward to seeing you and your boat in May,

Laszlo

 

Kentaro,

Nice little model. Even more than on the real boat, I think you need a clear port in the sail :-)

Laszlo

 

Kentaro:

Thank you for your comment. I too started out thinking I would finish the boat bright, but as I worked at filling the weave and fairing the hulls it became apparent that I wouldn't get the quality I needed for a varnish finish. That allowed me to switch to mixing microballoons with the epoxy to fair the hulls, another tip I credit to Lazlo. The result isn't perfect, but it easily passes the 10 foot test. I've also decided that I like the look of a mostly painted boat with some touches of brightwork. Somehow makes the varished elements stand out more.

Nice little model. My only critique--and please take this in the spirit in which it is offered--is that you appear to have made the mast vertical. The actual boat's mast is canted forward. I won't delve into the physics, but this allows for a shorter (and therefore stiffer) mast for the same size sail and also raises the boom higher when it tacks over the vaka.

On the subject of models, I attach below a pic of a model of a traditional Micronesian proa, which parenthetically has a very raked mast. My son commissioned this for me while serving as a Peace Corps volunteer on the island of Satawan in the Mortlock Islands municipaity of Chuuk State, Micronesia. His posting there got me interested in proas, which lead me eventually to John at CLC  (via links to Madness) and now my own proa-inspired sailing outrigger canoe.